Mr. Griffin.

All right. Now, did you see Ruby move forward out of the crowd ?

Mr. Arnett.

Not out of the crowd. He was in front of me before I saw him.

Mr. Griffin.

Did you see him move in front of you ?

Mr. Arnett.

I can give you an illustration better than I can tell you.

Mr. Griffin.

All right. Illustrate.

Mr. Arnett.

Okay. I was standing like this, facing this way (indicating).

Mr. Griffin.

All right. Now, let's put Mr. Davis up in front of you, about where Blackie Harrison was.

Mr. Arnett.

All right.

Mr. Griffin.

You place him up there. And Oswald is going to be to your right.

Mr. Arnett.

I was looking over his shoulder [indicating].

Mr. Griffin.

All right.

Mr. Arnett.

The first thing

Mr. Griffin.

You were about that far away from him [indicating] ?

Mr. Arnett.

Something like that.

Mr. Griffin.

You were about 4 inches away from Blackie Harrison?

Mr. Arnett.

I would say something like that.

Mr. Griffin.

And looking over his right shoulder?

Mr. Arnett.

That's right. Lee Oswald came out [indicating]

Mr. Griffin.

You are looking to your right?

Mr. Arnett.

To my right. Lee Oswald came out, the two detectives, Leavelle and .Graves, Leavelle was handcuffed to Oswald. Graves was on the left side of him, had him by the arm. The first time I saw Jack Ruby he was just about in this position, just pow, that's just how quick it happened.

Mr. Griffin.

Now, you get back there in the position where you first saw Jack.

Mr. Arnett.

[Indicating.]

Mr. Griffin.

No. You get where you saw Jack [indicating].

Mr. Arnett.

Yes.

Mr. Griffin.

Is that about how far Jack was from

Mr. Arnett.

From Oswald when I saw him, I guess [indicating].

Mr. Griffin.

Is that how far he was from Harrison ?

Mr. Arnett.

He might have been a little further out this way from him, but (indicating).

Mr. Griffin.

In other words, the first time you saw Ruby, Ruby was standing forward, he was standing between--in front of Harrison in the direction of the Commerce Street ramp?

Mr. Arnett.

Right.

Mr. Griffin.

But he was off to Harrison's left?

Mr. Arnett.

He was to Harrison's left a little bit.

Mr. Griffin.

What direction was Ruby facing when you saw him ?

Mr. Arnett.

Just as you and I [indicating].

Mr. Griffin.

Facing almost directly at Oswald?

Mr. Arnett.

Yes, sir.

Mr. Griffin.

At that point?

Mr. Arnett.

In this position [indicating].

Mr. Griffin.

Now, did you see anybody standing behind his back?

Mr. Arnett.

Did I see anybody behind Ruby's back?

Mr. Griffin.

Yes.
Mr. ARNETT, No, sir.

Mr. Griffin.

All right. Now, who would have been directly--as you are standing, directly toward Ruby's right, which would be up the Main Street ramp, who would have been standing right in that position along the row that you were in, directly to Ruby's right, toward the Main Street ramp [indicating] ?

Mr. Arnett.

Well, I named this newsman with a pad, I mean, I said--I didn't know his name. I said he was to my right. Mr. GRIFFIN. To your left?

Mr. Arnett.

Yes; left.

Mr. Griffin.

All right. Now, that man was to your left. Was Ruby right in front of him or was he right in front of Captain King?